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AT THIS HOUR WITH BERMAN AND MICHAELA
Putin: Ready to Join U.S.-Led Coalition Against ISIS; Protests Expected in New York, Chicago Over Teen Shooting Video; Why Michael Dukakis Collects Turkey Carcasses. Aired 11:30-12p ET
Aired November 27, 2015 - 11:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[11:33:18] JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Russian President Vladimir Putin now says he's ready to cooperate with the U.S.-led coalition to defeat ISIS. But is he really and how many conditions? While he says all of that, is he on the offensive rhetorically, at least, against Turkey. He says Turkey committed an act of betrayal by shooting down a Russian warplane, although Turkey says it violated Turkish air space.
Joining us is "Military Times" special contributor, Naveed Jamali. He's a naval intelligence officer and author of "How to Catch a Russian Spy."
So Vladimir Putin with a range of responses, I'll help you if you do it my way, on the one hand, and on the other hand, Turkey, a bunch of criminals.
NAVEED JAMALI, SPECIAL CONTRIBUTOR, MILITARY TIMES & NAVAL INTELLIGENCE OFFICER & AUTHOR: That's right. Let me start off, John, by saying I spent a number of years working with the Russians. I'm a former adversary. I want to first extend my sympathy for the loss of their crewmen and a speedy return and hope the other crewman gets well soon.
BERMAN: That's more than the Turks have done.
JAMALI: That's right.
BERMAN: They have not apologized or mourned over loss of life.
JAMALI: And still there's a lot of debate whether the plane was over Turkish air space or not. And the Turks have been bristling for this for quite a while.
BERMAN: But what does that have to do, then, with the battle in Syria right now? Is Russia going to get involved in the U.S.-led coalition against ISIS? Russia is in Syria doing its thing, largely battling against forces fighting Bashar al Assad, not primarily battling ISIS. Does this mean or does this affect Vladimir Putin perhaps getting involved in the coalition?
JAMALI: I think we have to look at this from, everyone agrees they want ISIS out. The other thing is, though, they always -- there's always a "but." They always want something else. The Russians want Assad in power. They want their footprint in Syria. The Americans want to contain. The French want Assad out but they don't want to send troops. The question here is, why can't they get ISIS out? There's no reason we physically, with the military coalition, we can't push them out. I think the Russians want that footprint. It's very, very important. They need Assad in power. If ISIS was wiped out tomorrow, there's a vacuum. So until we have a solution, what's going to happen with Syria, no one is going to push ISIS out.
[11:35:30] BERMAN: How far do you think Vladimir Putin and the Turkish President Erdogan will push this macho battle over the shooting down of the Russian plane?
JAMALI: Just as we saw -- and they put the S-400, which is a fairly sophisticated integrated air system. It's a game-changer. It poses quite a dilemma and quite a threat to the air crews flying in the region.
That being said, I think this is just posturing. The Russians do not want to go to war with Turkey or war with NATO. The Turks called Putin's bluff on this. The plane violated their air space. They were legally within their right to shoot it down. I don't think the Russians were intending to skirt Turkish air space. But in the past they have done that. They clearly had done that. I don't think that's the case here. And I think cooler heads will prevail but they'll do some public posturing.
BERMAN: We'll see if and when thse cooler heads prevail and how much of the posturing happens before.
Naveed Jamali, thank you for being with us.
JAMALI: Thank you.
BERMAN: I appreciate it.
At any moment, we're expecting protests here in New York and in Chicago, trying to disrupt the holiday shopping. This is all over the shooting of a black teenager by a white officer. We'll go there live in just a moment.
[11:40:57] BERMAN: Happening right now, demonstrations in Chicago looking to disrupt one of the busiest shopping days of the year. This follows the release of the video showing a white police officer shooting and killing teenager Laquan McDonald in Chicago.
Our Ryan Young is there where these protests are getting ready to kick off -- Ryan?
RYAN YOUNG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: We know protests will start around 11:00. A gathering has already started here. People say they're ready to do some work and get out in the streets. They want voices heard.
I want to introduce you. I already know who you are, most people already know, Reverend Jesse Jackson, here with a lot of people about what's happening in the streets of Chicago.
JESSE JACKSON, RAINBOW PUSH COALITION & CIVIL RIGHTS ACTIVIST: The demonstration may be civil disobedience and boycotts until fundamental justice occurs. For example, we look at Laquan whose revelation of the tape getting killed is 13 months later by a policeman who had been charged 18 times before. This is a pattern and practice of this corruption. 450 killed this year. 2700 shot this year. And 75 percent unsolved murders. You have recycled murderers walking the streets. We want a special prosecutor. We cannot accept the state attorney's being the prevailing lawyer. We want to know about the tape and who covered it up for 13 months.
BERMAN: What kind of change do you want to see in the next few months? People are upset when they see those 15 shots.
JACKSON: The police department has to change, the infrastructure. It's not just the guy who killed him, it's the nine people who watched it and did not stop him and did not charge him in their report. It's the infrastructure. If you change the head, don't change the heart, nothing really happens. We need a new police infrastructure. Secondly, a state's attorney that's credible again. This state's attorney has no credibility. We also need to know about the cover-up. The killing is one thing, the cover-up is another one. This was strategically covered up. $5 million paid, sight unseen, a half million for cop misconduct. That's not the teachers being laid off. We deserve justice and we deserve it now.
YOUNG: A larger conversation is happening. We'll be here throughout the afternoon. People are marching up Michigan Avenue. We want to show you how the gathering has already begun before the 11:00 hour.
BERMAN: Ryan Young, we'll check back with you in Chicago. Thanks so much.
Coming up for us, a CNN quiz. Which former major party nominee for president collects Turkey carcasses? Here's a hint. He ran against the guy you just heard there. We'll have the answer for you right after this.
[11:48:10] BERMAN: All right. You are looking at pictures from moments ago. That is the first lady, obviously, Michelle Obama, and moments ago at the White House, she greeted, accepted or was there for the delivery of the White House Christmas tree. It is an 18.5-foot Frazier fir grown in Pennsylvania by Jay and Glenn Bustern (ph). And I think they brought their mother, Virginia, along as well. So this will be the White House Christmas tree. It is not Douglas fir, and if that is controversial, please tweet me and tell me why.
Coming up for us now, a really fantastic story. I don't know any other way to put it, but I'll just say Mike Dukakis collects Turkey carcasses. We learned this by reading an article in the "Boston Globe" by Matt Pfizer. And it explains that after Thanksgiving every year, the former governor and Democratic nominee for president hordes as many Turkey carcasses as he can for as long as he can. And why, you might ask?
Well, let's ask him, shall we? Joining us from Massachusetts, the former governor of Massachusetts, Michael Dukakis.
Good morning, Governor.
MICHAEL DUKAKIS, (D), FORMER MASSACHUSETTS GOVERNOR & FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE (voice-over): Good morning, John.
BERMAN: And so you were three-term governor of Massachusetts, a Democratic nominee for president. Why do you horde the Turkey carcasses?
[11:49:30] DUKAKIS: Well, when I was a kid, John, my mother would make Turkey soup after the feast. I loved the feast but I loved the Turkey soup even more. So when I was married and started having kids, I began to make the Turkey soup from our own carcass. And then I discovered some of our friends were throwing the carcass away, and I said, how could you do this? Turkey soup. And by the way, my grandkids love it. I said you have to hang on to it and freeze it, if you have to, and then turn it into soup. And our granddaughter, and our oldest granddaughter, who was in Washington, was talking to Matt Pfizer of "The Globe" a year ago, and explained to him that I did this ever Thanksgiving, and remembered to call me back shortly before Thanksgiving and said, are you still collecting the Turkeys, and I said, yes. I take them and freeze them and periodically over the course of the year, I have been making soup. He wrote the story, the front page of the "Boston Globe," and now, we have had over a dozen carcasses delivered to our door this morning. And so I'm thinking maybe we will have to do something in our town or our community to share this with others as well. It's been fun. And the reaction has been remarkable. So it's been a fun Thanksgiving with all of this.
BERMAN: And 12 carcasses so far. And the morning is young, and only noon here on the east coast, and so there could be a lot more.
BERMAN: Explain to me how the process works. How do you save the carcass and for how long? I understand that you just finished last year's Turkey soup last week?
DUKAKIS: Well, you freeze these things for a year anyway, so I freeze them, or I have so many of them that I put them in the freezer of the next door neighbor. And thinking of doing something in the community with some of these to share good Turkey soup with others. But periodically, you know, when the grandkids are over and they love this stuff, I will pull out one of the frozen carcasses and toss it in a pot of water and quarter an onion and lots of salt and pepper, and simmer the thing for three hours, and then throw in some rice and throw in the leftover vegetables from the feast or anything else that you have got. And let me tell you, you have got the great meal. Combine it with a Greek salad and freshly baked bread, there's nothing better.
BERMAN: You ran for president in 1988, and if you had won, do you believe that this could have been a White House thing, and some kind of national Turkey carcass drop off at the White House.
DUKAKIS: I never thought of it, John. But lots of people out there who could use some good meals and nutrition, and maybe we could have a national, what, Turkey soup cook-off or something and encourage people to use these things. A lot of people are throwing them out, and they are missing a fabulous meal. So maybe if I had become president of the United States we could have had thousands and millions of people out there making Turkey soup and sharing it with others, but it is fun for us. Given the reaction to us, maybe I will suggest it to the president. Who knows?
BERMAN: You grew up in Massachusetts, and people may not know what I know, which is that you hate waste. There is nothing that bothers you more than people who waste things, and throwing things out, so this is right up your alley.
DUKAKIS: Let me tell you as the son of Greek immigrants, you waste nothing. I heard from my dad over and over, and he would use a word that means be thrifty and save it and never waste anything. I grew up with that, but I also love the Turkey soup. But it is fabulous. So it is a nice combination of not wasting and having something delicious.
BERMAN: So thank you, Mike Dukakis, from the great city of Brookline. And if you get more Turkey carcasses, we hope that you share them with the friends and relatives of the city.
Thank you so much, sir.
DUKAKIS: Thanks, John. Appreciate it.
BERMAN: That is the most fun thing ever.
And next week, CNN will air our "All-Star Tribute" to the top-10 "CNN Heroes." That is Sunday, December 6th, at 8:00 eastern. You will hear about how people were inspired to change things all around the world. Watch.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR, A.C. 360: I'm Anderson Cooper. And hopefully, by now, you have had a chance to check out the 10 remarkable people, the 10 "CNN Heroes, An All-Star Tribute." Each one of them is proof that one person can make a difference and this year.
Again, this year, we are making it easy for you to soup port their great work. Go to CNNheroes.com and go to the donate button to make a contribution to Amazon or one or more of the honorees. It is fast and secure and 100 percent of your donation will be sent to your designated non-profit. You'll also receive an e-mail confirmation your donation, and it is tax-deductible in the United States. CNN is proud to celebrate all of the everyday people changing the world. And through December 31st, you have a wonderful way to contribute to their cause. So from your laptop, tablet or phone, go to CNNheroes.com, and any donation in any amount will help them to help others.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[11:55:18] BERMAN: Do not miss the all-star tribute next Sunday at 8:00 p.m. eastern time right here on CNN.
Thank you for joining us AT THIS HOUR. And on behalf of Mike Dukakis, that is all for us.
"Legal View" with Ashleigh Banfield will start right after a quick break.
ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.
[12:00:07] ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Ashleigh Banfield. And welcome to "Legal View."