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Terror Threat Increase; More Security for Europe; Diplomatic Ties Cut; Benefit Concert for Victims. Aired 3-4a ET
Aired June 5, 2017 - 03:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[03:00:00] MAX FOSTER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello and welcome to our viewers around the world. I'm Max Foster in London with the very latest in the investigation of the terror attack here.
The Prime Minister, Theresa May, will chair an emergency security meeting in the coming hours. Also police say they are speaking with people detained in two new raids early on Monday.
ISIS claiming responsibility for the rampage in Central London, but the terror group is offering no evidence at all to support that claim. The attack lasted about 18 minutes, starting when this rental van drove into pedestrians on London Bridge.
The three attackers then left the van and went on a stabbing rampage in the popular Borough Market. The local baker recorded some of the aftermath. We warn you that some of the images here are disturbing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Take this. Take this, yes.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FOSTER: You can see police officers helping the wounded there. Police fired what they're calling an unprecedented 50 rounds to kill the attackers, who appear to be wearing suicide belts. Those belts turned out to be fake. No word yet on their identities although the police are likely to reveal that a bit later on when it's not as crucial to the investigation.
We're also learning more about some of the victims. Christine Archibald from Canada is amongst the seven people killed. Forty-eight others were wounded, many of them critically. They're still in hospital. Following Saturday's deadly terror attack, police raided a housing complex in east London. 11 people were arrested, including several women.
CNN's Melissa Bell spoke to residents who rocked among the three dead attackers are familiar face.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The man I know, he was a wonderful guy. MELISSA BELL, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Several neighbors
spoke to CNN of a family man who kept himself to himself and whose behavior had raised no alarm bells. But one woman did have her doubts.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: All of a sudden, we saw this gentleman individual speaking to the kids and gathering them for the last, it was the afternoon already, and speaking to them about Islam and showed them how to pray. So he was standing over there. We could see from the window.
BELL: Erica said she confronted the man and then went to the police with her concerns although she doesn't think anything was done. Locals say that this is where he prayed, a mosque he attended, they say, after an argument at another mosque.
Authorities here have so far refused to confirm the man's identity, choosing instead to extend their thoughts and prayers to the victims of London Bridge and their families.
Melissa Bell, CNN, Barking.
FOSTER: Witnesses describing the ordeal that they went through. They're also calling for unity. We're hearing from a woman who was on London bridge during the attack, and she describes what she saw when the van came right towards her.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HOLLY JONES, WITNESS: At this point, this is when I saw the driver of the vehicle and definitely intentional. You know, he didn't look scared. He just looked focused, and I'd almost like to say the word demented. That's what he looked like. And at this point, that was when he was heading straight towards me.
And there was a couple behind me as well. And I was aware of this couple because I'd passed them earlier on the bridge because they were walking quite slowly and I was late. They were a French couple, I know it is and they were speaking French. And I knew they were right behind me.
And I don't know how I did it or what I did, but I got out of the way. I don't know if I jumped or if I ran. And I remember moving and watching the van drive into the couple that were behind me and obviously hit them. The people that did this, they want us to be scared.
There's obviously a lot of scared and angry people out there, but I plead with people not to be scared, not to be angry because this is exactly what those people want us to feel. And we have to stand together.
Go home. Tell your friends, tell your family that you love them and carry on. Carry on doing exactly what you're doing. Don't be angered. Channel that anger into something positive and all the victims and their families, we just need to rally around and show support.
So I'm not going to let this affect me in a negative way, and I think everybody needs to understand that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FOSTER: The stories are pretty horrific we're hearing. I'm joined now though by Otso Iho, he's a senior analyst with Jane's Terrorism and Insurgency Centre.
It's your job now to try and make sense of all of this just as the politicians are going to try and do this week.
[03:05:02] How would you advise politicians going into the election to look at it in a constructive way?
OTSO IHO, SENIOR ANALYST, IHS JANE'S TERRORISM AND INSURGENCY CENTRE: Well, whatever government we end up getting in a week's time, they'll be facing the same problems. That's issues with resourcing, making sure that the resources are in place to monitor the individuals that need to be monitored and to increase law enforcement capability to do things like positive community support and community engagement.
FOSTER: There's no one is questioning the immediate response. It seems pretty incredible by all standards. We'll hear more as time goes on. We're now hearing that 12 people are in custody. A huge amount of forensic material has been gathered as well. What are they looking for there because it doesn't feel like there's a wider network here?
IHO: So what police are trying to identify right now is whether that wider network exists, and then how these attackers are connected to potentially existing radical networks in London or elsewhere in the U.K.
FOSTER: Or whether it's just three guys working together on their own?
IHO: Sure, that is a possibility. And of course the Islamic state, for example, has encouraged these types of attacks by individuals or small cells. But what the police will be looking for are any indications of direct communications, for instance, between these individuals and Islamic state operatives.
FOSTER: Should we allow them to claim it when there's no evidence that they had anything to do with it?
IHO: Well, the Islamic claims are a tool for it to project its influence and connect itself with attacks that sometimes it has a connection with, but other times it doesn't at all.
FOSTER: It's just P.R., right? They're jumping on something which is getting headlines?
IHO: That's certainly -- that's certainly one of the desired outcomes for this I must say.
FOSTER: Because it matters because then you can figure out how to address it that it was directed in some way from (Inaudible).
IHO: Absolutely. It's a key thing that needs to be figured out by the police in terms of whether this was inspired and conducted purely off the attackers' own backs, or whether there was an actual operational link or a kind of direction provided by the Islamic state.
FOSTER: There were some local media reports saying that there were very clear tip-offs about this, at least one of the guys involved to the anti-terror hotline, and it doesn't seem to have been followed up, or maybe it was. We don't know. But this is an ongoing issue, isn't it, that these people are nearly all accounting the case where these people haven't turned up on a watch list somewhere.
IHO: Absolutely. And there's a lot of -- there's a lots of discussion around increasing police capabilities to penetrate deeper into networks. But actually it's also about having the resources to be able to follow up on case like this.
IHO: And be able to fully utilize the resources that are already there and the capabilities that are already there.
FOSTER: OK. Otso, thank you very much indeed. Certainly something Jeremy Corbyn the labor leader is going big on already, saying the police and security forces need more resources.
CNN's senior international correspondent Fred Pleitgen is near Borough Market where the attackers went on their stabbing rampage. And it's closed again obviously today.
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, absolutely, Max. You do have people here at this location here in Borough Market who are returning back to work in the vicinity. However, the market itself has announced earlier today that it is actually still going to remain closed.
Obviously there is still a lot of forensic work going on inside that market. The authorities obviously still working on some of the sites there because this is also one of the places, of course, where that rampage that those three attackers went on, the stabbing rampage lasted for quite a long time.
We keep talking about the police officers ended all of this within time of about eight minutes. However, before that, they obviously went through that place, into several cafes, into several bars, and so certainly the authorities are picking through all of that evidence to see what they can find. Anything that will further their investigation.
Of course we've been talking about it, Max. It's something that the authorities have been doing ever since this incident took place. And we just now got news that par apparently there are 12 people who are now in custody.
A lot of forensic evidence has already been recovered from this site here, but also of course from the places that have been raided over the past two days on Sunday and then of course again earlier this morning as well. And 12 people are now in custody.
So the police are moving very, very quickly. We're not getting very many details as to the identities of people who are being detained or as to the identities of anybody who might be involved in this.
But I think one of the things that you guys were just talking about, which is absolutely correct, the authorities are trying to find out whether or not there's any sort of broader link to a broader terror organization and whether or not these people were working with others to conduct this attack or whether they were doing it mostly on their own, and that's certainly something where the police are saying, we need to cordon these areas off. We need to make sure that we find every single shred of evidence that could bring us forward in this investigation.
[03:10:02] That of course they want to get done as fast as possible and also as thoroughly as possible as well, Max.
FOSTER: After the Manchester attack, the threat level nationally was increased. That hasn't been the case this time. Why is that?
PLEITGEN: Well, that's a very good question. You're absolutely right. After the Manchester attack, the threat level was increased to critical for a while, saying that there could be another attack that was imminent.
And the reason for that, as we recall back then, was that the authorities there said they weren't sure whether or not there was a larger network. And, in fact, they believed that there was a larger network that was behind the attacks in Manchester, that there was some sort of help.
A lot of that had to do with the fact that in the Manchester attack, explosives were used. Authorities really didn't believe that Salman Abedi was capable of manufacturing a sophisticated, improvised explosive device that would have been capable of doing the damage that of course was done with those 22 people who were murdered in that incident.
This incident here, there's a lot less high-tech. It's very low-tech. It was using a vehicle. It was using knives, and the authorities are already saying they don't necessarily believe that there was any sort of broader logistical support, but especially also broader technical support as well.
Once you go get into the realm of manufacturing improvised explosive devices, you do need people with a great deal of expertise to not only make those improvised explosive devices work, but to also make them work in a robust fashion to make sure that you can go somewhere and blow yourself up and not just do it in an environment where you're actually testing these things.
So, they believe that there's not necessarily much in the way of technical support behind all this, but again the investigation is still going on. It is obviously in the fairly early stages. But the fact that the terror threat level has not yet been upgraded, are points to the fact that most probably they believe that there is not necessarily a more professional network or a broader network behind these attacks, Max.
FOSTER: OK, Fred. Thank you. Life sort of getting back to normal, apart from the fact that a lot of the roads are closed off. We know that the main station here has opened for arrivals, not departures. So things trying to get back to normal, and there's a sense of defiance about that as well.
U.S. President Donald Trump has been slammed here for his response to the attack in which he renewed the call for his controversial travel ban. But at a social event in Washington on Saturday night, the president actually took a softer tone and offered his unwavering support to the U.K.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: America sends our thoughts, our prayers, and our deepest sympathies to the victims of this evil slaughter, and we renew our resolve, stronger than ever before, to protect the United States and its allies from a vile enemy that has waged war on innocent life, and it's gone on too long. This bloodshed must end. This bloodshed will end.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FOSTER: Trump took to Twitter to criticize comments made by London's mayor just hours after the attack. The U.S. President slammed Sadiq Khan for saying citizens should not be alarmed despite the number of victims in Saturday's rampage. But Mr. Trump didn't address the full content of the mayor's remarks. Here's what Mr. Khan actually said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SADIQ KHAN, MAYOR OF LONDON: Londoners will see an increased police presence today and over the course of the next few days. No reason to be alarmed. One of the things the police and all of us need to do is make sure we're as safe as we possibly can be.
I'm reassured that we are one of the safest global cities in the world if not the safest global city in the world. But we always evolve and review ways to make sure we remain as safe as we possibly can.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FOSTER: Well, a spokesman for the London mayor calls Mr. Trump's comments ill informed.
We're learning more about the victims of the attack. Many of them are still getting medical care. Dozens are still in hospital. Our Erin McLaughlin is outside King's college hospital for us. The victims weren't just British, Erin.
ERIN MCLAUGHLIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Max. We're hearing of victims from a variety of different countries, Australia, France, as well as Canada, including Christine Archibald. She was killed on the London Bridge according to her family, struck by the terrorist vehicle.
The brother of her fiance saying that medical services did everything they could to save her life. She moved from Canada where she was working for homeless shelters here to Europe to be with her fiance.
Her family releasing a statement. Let me read you part of it. This is what they'd like you to know about Christine Archibald. They say, quote, "We grieve the loss of our beautiful, loving daughter and sister. She had room in her heart for everyone and believed strongly that every person was to be valued and respected. She lived this belief working in a shelter for the homeless until she moved to Europe to be with her fiance."
[03:15:02] "She would have had no understanding of the callous cruelty that caused her death." They go on to ask that, "we honor her by helping our local community, volunteering or donating to homeless shelters." Christine Archibald, one of seven tragic stories, tragically killed in that horrific attack. Max?
FOSTER: Thankfully lots of survivors but many of them in a critical condition still. The numbers are still high in terms of people in hospital.
MCLAUGHLIN: That's right. The update from the national health service as of Sunday was 36 individuals being treated at a number of hospitals in the London area, 21 in critical care. Some 14 individuals being treated here at King's College Hospital, including Daniel O'Neill. He was 23 years old. He was stabbed at the Borough Market. His mother talked to CNN yesterday. She says he's in shock.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ELIZABETH O'NEILL, DANIEL O'NEILL'S MOTHER: He was in shock. And he said, I don't think work will believe that this has happened. I'm going to have to go in on Monday, but he was in shock. I said to him, it's because you don't believe it's happened, Daniel. You think other people are going to find it hard. And he feels very bad that he's alive while others have died.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MCLAUGHLIN: She also says that she wants to find the two police officers who came to his aid. She credits them with saving his life. We're also hearing the story of Geoff Ho. He's a journalist for The Sunday Express, a newspaper here in London.
According to the Express, he was at a pub in Borough Market and intervened when the terrorists tried to stab the pub's bouncer. He was stabbed in the neck. There's social media footage of him calmly walking away from the scene to be treated by doctors, bleeding out of his neck. He's being hailed as a hero, one of many really heroic stories from that terrible, tragic night, Max. FOSTER: Some stories of heroism as well coming through. Because so
many people are involved, there are those stories, right? People are talking about that today and trying to find some hope in that.
MCLAUGHLIN: Absolutely. You know, speaking to Londoners here, people are shocked at what happened, but they're also making the point, Max, that they're resilient, that they are not going to be cowed by this horrific act.
FOSTER: OK. Erin, thank you very much indeed. That's the message that we've been getting in all sorts of forms today, and they'll continue coming through.
The prime minister very much speaking to that, calling for a tougher stance as well. Coming up, Theresa May's plans for combating Islamist extremism.
[03:20:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
FOSTER: Let's get you up to date on the latest developments in the London attack over the weekend.
The Prime Minister Theresa May will chair a meeting of the U.K. emergency security committee in the coming hours. Police say 12 people are in custody, and there's a lot of forensic material that's also being seized. They conducted a number of raids in east London since Saturday's attack.
The media wing of ISIS is claiming responsibility for it. No evidence about though. And seven people were killed. Forty-eight others wounded. Here's what one witness saw.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TYSON OLADOKUN, WITNESS: As I drove closer towards the incident, I saw a man lying on the floor. He was cradled by another man and had blood on his chest. At first it looked like a bicycle accident or motor accident, but as I moved closer towards him, I could tell that the blood was concentrated in his chest area.
So it looked like he had been stabbed. I saw another person lying down next to him, and they had covered his head with a blanket. It did look like this guy may have died. We were stuck there for around 30 minutes or so. We weren't moving. There was a lot of commotion. People were going crazy.
The police seemed relatively calm at the time. It was only subsequently I saw quite a lot of city police, and they were chasing people across the bridge. This was just normal civilians, normal pedestrians over the bridge and screaming at them to run, run, run for your lives. Terror.
(END VIDEO CLIP) FOSTER: So many witnesses to this because so many people were
involved. Police were on the scene in eight minutes, firing 50 shots, we understand, to kill those three attackers.
Now, this was the third militant attack in Britain in about three months. Earlier the prime minister said enough was enough and insists that the U.K. must be tougher on Islamist extremism.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
THERESA MAY, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: While we have made significant progress in recent years, there is, to be frank, far too much tolerance of extremism in our country. So we need to become far more robust in identifying it and stamping it out across the public sector and across society.
That will require some difficult and often embarrassing conversations. But the whole of our country needs to come together to take on this extremism.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FOSTER: Well, Nina Dos Santos is at 10 Downing Street. She joins us now with more. We do expect an update from that Cobra meeting where we'll get the latest on the investigation of what we know, right?
NINA DOS SANTOS, CNN CORRESPPONDENT: That's right. So the prime minister is chairing another one of those emergency so-called Cobra meetings with heads of various intelligence agencies as well as the home secretary as well in a few minutes, Max.
In fact, once that has happened, it's expected that she'll take to the steps of number 10 Downing street to brief people and give a big speech on the issue of security and counterterrorism.
Remember that the election campaign yet again gets underway in the final three days of campaigning here before the vote on Thursday. And so security really is one point that she is keen to ram home to the British electorate.
[03:25:02] In fact, just recently an Ipsos MORI poll found that among British voters, it was the second most important issue, second only to the future of the public health system, the NHS. And she's long branded Jeremy Corbyn, her opponent here, as being weak on the issue of security.
Mind you, on the other hand, he, yesterday evening said that he accused her of policing the country on the cheap. That's a reference to the fact that she was actually home secretary for several years before stepping into number 10 Downing Street just under a year ago. And during that time, she actually spearheaded around about 20,000 cuts to the police service.
So he was saying, well, look, the number of police officers has been diminished, and that could be one of the reasons why this country faces these kinds of terrorism threats that it faces today. As you pointed out there, three attacks in 11 weeks, leaving 34 people dead. That is one of the worst spates of terrorist atrocities that this country seen in around about 12 years all the way back since Tony Blair was in office 12 years ago during the time of the 7/7 bombings.
He, as well just like Theresa May in the aftermath of that demanded tougher security rules. Whether or not those rules were tough enough, that is the question, Max.
FOSTER: OK. Nina there in Downing Street, thank you. Confronted with senseless violence there, and there are calls for unity instead of division. And we're going to hear from one man next who's been affected by extremist brutality.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was like a big panic kind of thing.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: People running and screaming.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: People running. Like some people were screaming. Some people were in tears from what they were seeing and things like that.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
[03:29:59] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So like I said, it was a bit, it was a bit crazy. So many different emotions and things going on at the same time. I saw a lady. This was like a small family, blocking her kids around some corner. She'd probably seen everything that I hadn't seen.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And they were just the looks on their faces. Like you could tell like they're not going to recover so well from that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FOSTER: A lot of trauma in London right now. So many people witnessed the attack because so many people were involved. And obviously people directly affected.
Twelve people now in custody after Saturday's terror attack here in London. Police have carried out multiple raids in east London. Authorities say they've seized a huge amount of forensic material as well. Investigators are trying to determine if the three attackers had any sort of help. At least seven people were killed. 48 were wounded.
Isa Soares has more on how the rampage unfolded.
ISA SOARES, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: A night of violence and fear.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, my God!
SOARES: Terror in the heart of London.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just keep moving!
SOARES: It began on London Bridge. A van plowing down pedestrians. Barreling towards them, witnesses saw people go flying into the air. One jumped into the River Thames to get out of the way.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was like a big panic kind of thing like that.
SOARES: People running?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: People running. Some people screaming. Some people were in tears from what they were seeing.
SOARES: The attackers in this rental van sped across the bridge, crashed, and then continued on foot toward nearby Bborough Market. Charging inside, the attackers started stabbing people. Open late Saturday night, the area packed with customers.
Authorities say the attackers were shot and killed by police. Laying on the ground, their fake explosive belts exposed. The scene they left behind, chaotic.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We were fearing for our lives. We heard noise which we thought were gunshots, and we thought it was game over for ourselves.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You are (Inaudible) we ask you to remain calm.
SOARES: In the wake of the attack, heightened police presence. Security tightened and British Prime Minister Theresa May convened an emergency security meeting.
MAY: It is time to say enough is enough. Everybody needs to go about their lives as they normally would. Our society should continue to function in accordance with our values. But when it comes to taking on extremism and terrorism, things need to change.
SOARES: And with the election days away, the parties suspended campaigning.
JEREMY CORBYN, LABOUR PARTY LEADER: We won't be campaigning nationally during today, but we're resuming later on because I think it's important to give a message that democracy must prevail. If we allow these attacks to disrupt our democratic process, then we all lose.
SOARES: This is a city on high alert with thousands of police on the street. But we've also seen a strength of character here in London as so many people opened their doors to those who couldn't go back into their properties or indeed to the hotels. A strength of character that really says that Londoners will not be cowed by terrorism.
Isa Soares, CNN, London. (END VIDEOTAPE)
FOSTER: People in London certainly are sending a strong message in the wake of the terror attack in their city. That message, love will win, not ISIS. A group of Muslim women held signs near at the site of the attacks in the heart of the city and they turned out to show support for the victims and those who helped them.
Joining me now is Mike Haines. He's a founder of Global Acts of Unity. His brother David was executed by ISIS. And what your talks have been tackling is the ideology so not so much focused on the response here, but how to prevent it in the first place.
You know, what advice would you give the prime minister and the leader of the opposition going into that election in trying to deal with this problem?
MIKE HAINES, FOUNDER, GLOBAL ACTS OF UNITY: The government is in a very difficult position. That fine line between infringing on people's rights, but also providing security. The security serves as the police of our country. They did a fine job. They did a fine job on Saturday night.
Unfortunately, we have to be lucky every time. They only have to be lucky once, and they have proved that and proved that three times in the past three months. So it's a very difficult situation for the government, for the police, but they are doing a sterling job.
FOSTER: It's very easy to say you've got to carry on as normal. But people outside London don't want to come in at the moment. They feel scary. What do yo say to them, I mean, do they defy that fear and just come in anyway?
HAINES: These terrorist attacks, no matter what supposed reason, no matter what supposed ideology, are all about spreading fear, division, and hatred.
[03:35:05] So if we buy into that, then we are doing the terrorists' job for them if we follow their thought patterns. If we allow them to dictate to us how we are going to act, they've done their job.
So we need to carry on our everyday lives. We need to face this hatred that the extremists, the terrorists want to bring into our lives with unity, with humanity.
FOSTER: There were some young people who didn't want to go to the concert in Manchester last night because they were scared. They didn't want to go to another concert. You can understand that, can't you? But that under your theory, that's them succumbing to the terror.
HAINES: It's very, very difficult for especially our young -- the targeting of the Ariana Grande concert was cowardly, disgusting beyond all recognition, as is every one of these terrorist attacks. It is up to the nation as a whole, not individuals. It's how we respond to these attacks. If we take that path of hatred and division, or do we take that path
that proves our humanity? The best response that us as a nation can apply to these attacks with is one of unity, is one of standing together, is one of they are never, ever going to destroy us. They're never, ever going to beat us.
FOSTER: When we say "they" are we talking about ISIS here because ISIS had claimed it, but there's no evidence to suggest they had any sort of direct involvement here. So should we even be talking about is, or should we be talking about crazy people who have got -- you know, who are evil essentially?
HAINES: Wherever a terrorist attack occurs, whoever causes it, that's not the real issue. It's how we respond as a nation. Now, you saw the people here in Westminster after the last attack. You saw the Mancunians. You saw people running to help. You saw taxi drivers giving free lifts.
Within minutes of the news hitting the internet...
HAINES: ... of the attack on Sunday night, there was offers of rooms, board, food. I even saw one post saying, you know, there's offers of lodging, there's offers of food, but nobody is offering a cigarette. Anybody need a smoke? And it's that attitude...
HAINES: ... that we are standing together across all cultures, across all faiths, across all backgrounds.
FOSTER: And this is a truly multi-cultural city, and the unity is very much on display today. Thank you very much indeed for joining us.
We'll have more on the investigation and how this nation is responding to the horror that struck on Saturday night after this break.
[03:40:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
FOSTER: Welcome back to London. There was a temporary pause in political campaigning yesterday following the attack, but it's back on today because there's an election on Thursday.
And I'm joined now by Emily Thornberry. She's a spokesman for foreign affairs to the opposition Labour Party here in the U.K. There's been a debate presumably yesterday about whether or not the campaign should be suspended because again it's responding to terrorists.
EMILY THORNBERRY, MEMBER, BRITISH PARLIAMENT: Yes, except I think that the agreement we came to was that it was right to have a pause while people were working out if their kids were in hospital.
THORNBERRY: If they, you know, just working out what had happened and also to have a moment in which we recognized and respected the enormous bravery of our police officers.
THORNBERRY: And what had happened. So the agreement was is that nothing would be done until the evening, and then Theresa May came out on the steps of number 10 Downing Street and made a speech that I wouldn't necessarily have made given the agreement. It was a more political speech than we were expecting.
FOSTER: You're suggesting because she referred to some of the things in her manifesto, right, in a speech when there wasn't meant to be campaigning.
THORNBERRY: I think some of the rhetoric around enough is enough.
THORNBERRY: I think that was rhetoric no necessarily anything that was -- and if there were -- if she was talking about anything that had to be done right now, then fine.
THORNBERRY: But coming out with a four-point plan...
THORNBERRY: ... sometime into the future looked like it was political campaigning to me.
FOSTER: And your party leader's criticism ramped up this morning when he said -- he effectively criticized the conservatives for reducing funding of the police services and security services. But is that to blame for terror attacks?
THORNBERRY: Well, I mean the first thing is we didn't just criticize it. It is the truth. The truth is there are 20,000 less police officers on our streets today than there was under...
FOSTER: But more armed police now.
THORNBERRY: The question is do we have sufficient numbers of armed police, and do we have sufficient numbers of people in our security services? And we have said before any of this happened, we put in our manifesto that we would put another 10,000 police officers back.
That would mean another police officer in each of the small communities of what we call wards in each area. That wouldn't by itself stop terrorism, but it would help with the communications between communities and the police.
It would mean an increase of police officers of about 8 percent. And in the end, effective policing, you know this. I know this. Effective policing is when you work with the community and you don't impose policing on a community. And so good lines of communications.
THORNBERRY: More police officers around to help.
FOSTER: No one is criticizing the response here. It was pretty incredible, wasn't it?
THORNBERRY: It was extraordinary.
FOSTER: But the intelligence gathering, there has been some criticism because local media reporting the attacker -- one of the attackers here in London and in Manchester, there were warnings sent into the anti-terror hotline about them, and they should have been followed up.
THORNBERRY: I think we need to take this in perspective. I think since the killing of Lee Rigby a few years ago, there have been a number of these plots that the intelligence services have found out about, and we've stopped.
So I think that, you know, a great deal of credit needs to be given to them. We now need to ask the question as to why we've had these three now. Is it a different nature? Has something happened? We need to look at that. Is it a result of lack of resources?
You know, all of these serious questions need to be asked. It's quite difficult because we won't get the answers between now and Thursday when the general election is happening, and there's obviously this heightened political tension because of the election.
THORNBERRY: It is something that we need to be thoughtful and considerate about and make sure that we are entirely resolute and focused on how we best deal with this issue. We have been doing well.
[03:45:05] FOSTER: Are you concerned about security around the Election Day?
THORNBERRY: It's always a concern, but in the end, you know, these murderers are attacking our very values, our very essence and what we need to do in response is be a democracy...
THORNBERRY: ... is get everybody out to vote.
FOSTER: The one thing we can't do is not have the election.
THORNBERRY: And it's a poke in the eye if we get a really high turnout.
FOSTER: Yes, exactly. And that's likely now, possibly, isn't it?
THORNBERRY: Well, let's hope so.
FOSTER: Thank you very much indeed.
We continue to follow developments on the London terror attack. But another breaking story for you this hour. Four Middle Eastern countries have cut off diplomatic ties with Qatar over what they say as the country support the terrorism.
Qatar just released the statement a short while ago calling the move unjustified and the allegation is baseless.
CNN's Muhammad Lila joins us from Abu Dhabi because this is very significant in terms of the region.
MUHAMMAD LILA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right. It's very significant in terms of stability in the Middle East. And Max, you know it's not just cutting off diplomatic relations. It's effectively cutting off all relations. We're talking about a ripple effect that could affect the aviation industry, oil prices, trade between these four countries and Qatar.
Those four countries, of course, are Saudi Arabia, Egypt, the United Arab Emirates, and Bahrain. They have been accusing Qatar of supporting Islamist groups in the region, creating instability in the region, and even supporting some terrorist groups in the region.
And what does it mean, severing ties? It means they are closing their borders and their airspace to all Qatari flights. They're stopping trade. They've given country diplomats 48 hours to leave the country. They've given country residents a deadline to leave the country as well.
Emirates Airlines and Etihad Airlines, as well as Fly Dubai, they've all announced that they will be stopping all flights to and from Doha. So this is more than just a slap on the wrist. This is a very severe severing of these ties. And of course the fallout could play out in the next several hours, several days, and in fact several weeks to come.
FOSTER: The foreign affairs ministry saying that this could destabilize the region. What do they mean by that?
LILA: Well, you have to remember that think about when Donald Trump came to visit Saudi Arabia. There was a convention of dozens of countries all putting on a united front, vowing to fight terrorism, and putting on a united front quite frankly against Iran. And many people believe that this severing of ties actually has to do more with Iran than Qatar.
There are some statements carried by Qatari media not too long ago that seemed to strike a conciliatory tone with Iran. That didn't sit well with Saudi Arabia and some of the other Gulf countries. Qatar came out and said those statements were fabricated.
But there's been a war of words in the media taking place between Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates on one side and Qatar on the other. Well, that war of words has now escalated very quickly into the severing of ties.
And of course, anytime you're talking about a coalition, whether it's the coalition that's currently in the middle of an air bombardment campaign in Yemen or a coalition that's talking about defending Bahrain or taking the fight to ISIS in Iraq or Syria, any ripple in that coalition is going to have a major consequence.
But this is more than just a ripple. This actually a severing of ties. So this is certainly something that will have broad consequences in the region and possibly beyond.
FOSTER: Muhammad in Abu Dhabi, thank you. Still ahead, some of the biggest names in music decided the show must go on.
Ariana Grande headlined the Manchester benefit concert in honor of the victims of last month's terror attack. London was also relevant there of course, and we'll take you there next.
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FOSTER: Well, the Manchester benefit concert last night went on as scheduled despite the London terror rampage. Pop star Ariana Grande headline the one love show honoring the victims and survivors of last month's deadly terror attack.
Her concert in Manchester, Sunday's all-star event, brought together 50,000 fans and some of the biggest names in music all in the name of strength and unity.
For more on the event, Phil Black joins us live from Manchester. And I watched part of it, Phil. Very moving. She did a quite incredible job.
PHIL BLACK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes it really was, Max. A truly extraordinary atmosphere there. The lineup of stars in themselves would have made for an extraordinary concert anywhere in the world on any given day.
It wasn't just Ariana Grande, it was Katy Perry, Miley Cyrus, Pharell Williams, Justin Bieber, Coldplay just some of them. But on top of that, you had that extraordinary emotional context, just two weeks after an apparent suicide bomber attacked Ariana Grande's fans and their parents outside of concert in the city, killing 22 people including seven children.
It all made for just a hugely emotional few hours. Conflicting emotions really. There was some sadness. There was in nervousness there as well. Some of those people, many of the people at the concert had been at Grande's concert two weeks ago. They'd heard the explosion and experienced the panic.
Overwhelmingly though, I think it was a joyous celebration of this community, one that has had very little reason for happiness really. Take a listen to some of the people who were there, what they thought and felt after experiencing this event. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I didn't want to come back tonight if I was honest. But my stepmom made me come back to try and get closure. But I'm still a bit scared going on now and stuff.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The atmosphere was fantastic. I couldn't have asked for anything more. I was terrified this morning. I was crying. I didn't want my daughter to go. I eventually went myself. So after all their music, it was outstanding.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLACK: So emotionally significant to the people of this city, but it will also be a practical benefit too. It raised, we expect, millions of dollars for the victims of the Manchester attack.
And overwhelmingly, a powerful statement rejecting the sort of violence that has taken and traumatized lives here in Manchester but of course London as well, Max.
FOSTER: Yes. There were obviously people that couldn't attend. They were too scared to go to a concert. What was the message to them because you can understand why they didn't want to go. But the whole message was that life had to go on. So what were people saying about that?
[00:05:06] BLACK: Well, there were also people who thought it was too soon to hold an event like this, people who were still dealing with the grief and the suffering that the attack caused.
But overwhelmingly, the community decided to go with this. It had the support of the police, who were determined to provide a safe environment for that huge crowd, and ultimately they did.
There were police everywhere around the ground, the venue. And on the way in, very strict security procedures. Everyone was searched individually.
So it all went off very smoothly, but there is no doubt the authorities were prepared. We saw very heavily armed police patrolling on foot around the ground late into the night just in case someone had tried to interrupt or disturb things, Max.
FOSTER: OK. Phil, thank you very much indeed. I'm Max Foster in London. Thank you for watching CNN. We'll be back for another hour of news, breaking news from the scene of this London terror attack.
And as we head towards the election on Thursday, a huge amount of debate about what can be learned from this when many people quite frankly feel it's just becoming part of the norm.
Is that the right attitude, or should there be something more proactive to be done here? We'll be analyzing all of that after the break.
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